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I am curious how you all retain players? This is brought up due to a personal experience of mine with the group, and this thread at CM..
http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/online-casino-poker-complaints/11053-casino-rewards.htmlthey seem to encourage their affiliates to market them all together implying that the same player could play all their bonuses.
That statement is true, you did have us market all of the casinos to the same players, so why would the support team go and close players accounts after they(the player) take you up on another promo that they so happen to see at our websites being advertised? They sure are not going to come to our websites anymore for recommendations to good casinos are they?
The way it works and the way it has always worked is as follows:
A player is welcome to join any and all of the casinos and claim the associated sign-up bonus.
If a player joins many sites of ours, and only does the very bare minimums across all those accounts in order to ‘score the bonus’ then they are very obviously somebody who has no real intent to spend their own money and actually gamble at our casinos. They are, simply put, only there to try and rip us off.
Keep in mind we aren’t trying to create a barrier to entry. We know that any new $20 deposit could turn into a whale someday. However, if they run around joining all our brands and exhibit the behavior mentioned above… well we all know what they’re up to. After a while all we say is that you can’t receive any more bonuses until you purchase and play i.e. show real intent to gamble. By doing this we are able to give more admin (that’s internal lingo for bonus money) to the thousands of real players who enjoy gaming.
Furthermore, if a player who fits this description eventually decides they do want to play casino, they can deposit and play. It’s just the free bonus money that stops being given out. Once they have a track record with us indicating they have intent to play then their status returns to normal. Pretty forgiving if you compare it to the real world.
As I said above, nothing has changed on our end regarding our policies on the matter and you guys have all been pushing us forever and obviously – except for a few players with no real intent to play – it works well and most have never had issue whatsoever.
Finally … keep in mind these players are of no value to your pocket book either unless they actually deposit and play!
Well Ryan I beg to dissagree on this issue here, you need to dig deeper and take a look around and see how many un-happy campers the group have run off!
Have a look here just for a start..
http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/online-casinos/11852-nostalgia-aztec-change-affiliate-companies.htmlWith this new sale, we stand to lose much money now with the casino being sold to your group. I will not stay quiet and hope there are changes made and fast, otherwise all the players we worked our bunns off to obtain for the last 4 months to bring into the Adriches casinos are going to be just tossed out the window!
“Finally … keep in mind these players are of no value to your pocket book either unless they actually deposit and play!”
Maybe I will take screenshots now at Adriches to show you we have no problem with players depositing now and then compair it with CR stats in like say 2 months.
Ryan wrote:The way it works and the way it has always worked is as follows:A player is welcome to join any and all of the casinos and claim the associated sign-up bonus.
If a player joins many sites of ours, and only does the very bare minimums across all those accounts in order to ‘score the bonus’ then they are very obviously somebody who has no real intent to spend their own money and actually gamble at our casinos. They are, simply put, only there to try and rip us off.
RANT MODE ON
What a load of self-serving rubbish.
:angry:THe second statement is a complete contradiction of the first statement.
That’s like a supermarket putting out coupons on loss-leaders to attract customers and then getting angry when the customers only buy the couponed items.
:withstupiNo one is “ripping you off”. They are choosing to take advantage of an advertised special in a legitimate way. I’ll agree that the casino and the affiliate is unlikely to make money on these players, but to blame the player (or the affiliate) in any way is completely out of order.
:slapface:Ryan, perhaps you should “keep in mind” that one bad experience gets publicised a lot more than 10 good experiences. This wishy washy approach as to who will and will not get the bonus does you no good at all.
And beleive me when someone is told that they are “ripping us off” or that they are “a bonus abuser” … then it is a very bad experience.
All it takes is a clear statement about the number of seperate bonuses allowed across the group (either as a specific value or a percentage of deposit) and players and affiliate will be happy.
RANT MODE OFF
Ryan, I shouldn’t really get on at your or your program here – as your responses here are always helpful and forthright – which I appreciate.
But this trotting out of the “company line” on an issue that does actually need to be fixed does you no credit at all … lets get the bonus limits clarified so no-one has to get the bad experience of being called a “bonus abuser” …
Hopefully we will hear some clearer thinking. I’ll be listening.
:allears:Hi Paul,
I just arrived in Amsterdam, and after a 27 hour trip door to door I’m a bit scattered at best
That said, I saw your ‘rant on’ in capital letters when I was skimming my blackberry so I figured I’d pop on to make a “semi-post”.
I say semi-post because I’m just addressing your comment about the “company line”.
… the ‘company line’, as you put it, IS a company line … but it’s not incorrect … and there are no well defined bonus amount for me to put forward … it’s based on the users behavior. What I’m getting at is that a player IS welcome to join EVERY casino and take EVERY bonus. So, to your point, I guess we do need to qualify/clarify what we consider a ‘player’… that is, a player who is not a bonus abuser by the definitions set forth by the company.
I’m not at liberty (player privacy) to comment on the guy’s posting at CM … but trust me, they are not telling the whole truth. They have more than made out ok from the casino.
To re touch on the bonus amounts being well defined or a percentage of deposit or something … I know that would be nice, in reality it’s just not possible. When you get banned from google for dirty tricks, they just send you a blanketing email saying ‘blah blah you did something bad’. If they actually told webmasters what they got caught for … then webmasters would be able to suss it out and beat the system.
In our case, the company wants to take a risk and put out a few extra bucks to those who look like real gamblers … basically we take a loss over the first few months in order to make money in the long run. If we put the exact specs on bonuses out there, the bonus whores would take advantage of it to the point that it would reduce the amount we can offer players who really plan to gamble … and that’s not something the company thinks is smart.
All that said, I’m not saying I don’t see your point, but the company tried being more lax in the past and it’s just resulted in huge losses. For everybody’s sake, we need to remain profitable and in business so you’ve got a place to refer the good players to
… and the obvious reason of giving me something to do for a day job 
j/kummm hello Ryan thanks for addressing Paul in the thread, what about my post above and my questions? From your response you seem to think is this all coming from one player, which infact it is not and you know that as well. There are many many highrollers getting tossed out of your group and being called abusers, there are post ALL over the net about “the company” running off good depositing players, this was a problem when you took over and it remains a problem, why not stand up for your affiliates and demand a change?
While I understand your considered point of view Ryan … and I know where the business is coming from …. you must admit that it does not stack up against the phrase ….
A player is welcome to join any and all of the casinos and claim the associated sign-up bonus
The player is obviously NOT welcome to do any such thing.
Change the phrase – or change the company attitude … as I believe that for every player that you disappoint you will also lose 10x potential sign-ups with the bad press.
:omg:Players will simply go somewhere that hasn’t been smeared with bad player press …
Hi Paul,
Your points are well received. The company line is the company line. So, as you insinuated previously, at least in this instance, I did simply repeat the ‘company line’. The company would argue the definition of a player, which would revalidate the line – at least for those to care to get caught up in semantics.
That said, I don’t think that is necessary because you know I understand what you are saying and I know you understand what the company is saying… even if you disagree with the wording.
So where does that leave us … no further ahead than when we started, except that you know that the company defines a player as somebody who has intent to spend their own money and will be able to claim all the bonuses if they choose to.
I think you made a good point about the supermarket and the typical lost leaders. There are obvious similarities (which we all know and agree on), but some food for thought:
When a user physically visits a store to claim a lost leader coupon they are physically _there_ … and as such … will likely, for the sake of convenience, get the other items they want there.
In cyber space, we don’t get the luxury of lazy customers who can’t be bothered to go else where … the next store of ours isn’t on the other side of town … it’s just one click away. As such, they can run around to all our ‘stores’ (to draw a comparison) very quickly and claim the coupon at them all without bother to stop and ‘shop’ (play with their own money in the companies definition).
I think you’d find if this happened at the supermarkets … and they had a way to track customers as they ran around the city cashing in on the good deal AND not buying anything else … then they would not allow it…. just my opinion, of course.
So, how does the ‘real world’ handle it … I think of offers where it’s ‘limit 1 per customer’ or ‘limit 4 per family’ type of thing … but the company here doesn’t want to do something like that because the majority of customers never have an issue and we don’t want to take the bonuses away from those ‘players’.
Anyway … I’ll stop rambling… as I said, some food for thought, if nothing else. However, I doubt that has had any impact on your feelings about the company line which I originally regergitated.
… and if I’ve been on a tangent and you really just want the words changed … what do you feel would be a good suggestion(s)? I’m happy to take it to the appropriate people
bonustreak wrote:ummm hello Ryan thanks for addressing Paul in the thread, what about my post above and my questions? From your response you seem to think is this all coming from one player, which infact it is not and you know that as well. There are many many highrollers getting tossed out of your group and being called abusers, there are post ALL over the net about “the company” running off good depositing players, this was a problem when you took over and it remains a problem, why not stand up for your affiliates and demand a change?I was referring to a single player at the time, but I’m sure you’re right that there are more people that have posted/complained/been deemed a bonus abuser (for right or for wrong) … you guys know I’m ‘not at liberty’ to discuss any player accounts for privacy reasons … but I think you’d be surprised how many of those who do post/complain only tell the half of the story that makes them seem right. They tried a trick, it didn’t work out … they go moan about it for spite.
Is that always the case? Don’t be silly … I’m sure, as you are, that there have been instances of would-be legitimate players being turned away. I’ve heard the story about somebody who knows the person personally and knows they are a wealthy…. or affiliates that know the player and know they gamble big $$ at another group. Why did the casino turn them away?? They are rich/big spenders, not looking for free money … unfortunately the company does have that personal relationship to base the decision on. The company only has that player’s behavior at this group’s sites/casinos to base the decision on. I think that is understandable.
If you had a store and every time a guy with baggy jeans, a head band, and ghetto blaster came in you got robbed … soon you’d stop letting them in … even if they said, “Hey, I just want to buy a bottle of water … you have it advertised in the window!” … eventually you just make the decision that you are safer to not allow that person in the store.
Personally, if I’m in the affiliate’s spot … I think I would share your opinion. Makes sense from the outside looking in … no question there. However, being on this side of the fence, I look at the numbers/patterns/trends and that data is the evidence that supports the company’s policy of ‘uh oh, that’s not good … we need to stop that’.
Anyway … if you’ve got suggestions on a better way to accomplish this, I’m certainly open to them. I think everybody can always improve and that includes this company. To that end, I’ll bubble up any suggestions you have to top management here.
Thanks for the response Ryan – always good to see considered responses.
:clapper:But it’s 11pm here -and I’ve had a few glasses of a delicious French red wine this evening – so let me try and respond in the morning – and not make the same mistake as Xasthur in another thread …
:drunk2:
