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Obama is putting himself in the Win Win column here
Greatest economic crisis since the great depression – False, not even close
The New Deal was a success – False, we would have gone bankrupt if not for WWII
Create or save 4 million jobs (note the save part, please tell me how you calculate that one, and thats his way of measuring success. With nancy palosi saying we loose 500 million jobs a month thats a shoe in)
If he does the press like last night we will never have more than 15 questions, I think he puilled a no content meaningless stuff job on his time.
Bottom line, spending is a BAD! it was bad when bush did it its even worse now that we see how bad it was before and were doing it again.
Oh, and I was laughing when he brought up Japans lost decade. They lost a Decade because they SPENT, and they SPENT a LOT MORE % wise than were even thinking of here. And he said it was because they didnt spend quick enough.
History is a funny thing when looked at correctly.
Hey there Chips!
I’ve not even had time to follow this last bill, but I do believe that having the government spending and deciding how to save the economy is not a good idea. Look what happened with that last Paulsen/Bush fiasco?
Anyway, I hope to catch up as soon as I have my site done by months end then I’ll be back. :tongue:
Remeber me screaming not to do TARP!
@allfreechips 197057 wrote:
Remeber me screaming not to do TARP!
LOL Yep, I sure do. That is one of the few times we were on the same page. :hattip:
I’m STILL upset over that!
Then you should be throwing chairs at this one.
@allfreechips 197076 wrote:
Then you should be throwing chairs at this one.
I’m not happy for sure, but there is no one else but the government to get us out of this hole.
My interests now is getting UIGEA overturned and the industry regulated.
Thats the problem, Goverment needs to get out of the picture and let the economy recover. Saving failing business with cash is a dead end. Spending is the same as you getting another credit card because you cant pay the min on the one you maxed out. Yeah it feels good for a little while but then your twice as screwed later.
Let me ask you, what is stopping ecomomic growth? Taxes are still at the same rate.
The fact the banks are propped up on goverment money is huge, should have let them crumle and have another buy the assets for real market value (bankruptsy has a real purpose)
Once they are at real value things would be stable, now this would incur losses of course but we cant keep trying to buy away real losses is what we are trying to do now and it can not work.
Housing was inflated, prices will drop.
What got us here?
Well the internet buble broke, we had a drop and recovered once all losses were taken as they should have been. Massive goverment spending (Yes the damn republicans were playing the spending sham as well). Corporate taxes, what is the purpose of corporate taxes? Corporation sure dont pay for them, we do so drop corporate tax as its a consumer tax. Drop income taxes to real rates. I am not in favor of the tax sytem now as it is a penalty for making money. Its so complicated even Obamas dream team cant figure them out apperntly?
What would be fair taxes? thats a real debate but it cant be set to penalize people who make the place run. I would suggest everything over 100K is taxed at 25% no write offs. simply you take in 110K you pay 25% of the 10K. Sound like we would run out of money right away doesnt it? but we wouldnt is the sad thing.
CUT GOVERMENT SPENDING – Goverment should be responsible only for what goverment was ment for. NO ENTITLEMENTS, NO SOCIAL SECURITY. responsibility and planning needs to be in the hands of the people.
Goverment should be making sure we are safe (military / foriegn relations) we are free from others infringing on our rights (LAW) and allowed to pursue happyness freely. Social programs do not work, its impossible. The only exeption is to care for people that can in no way care for themselves, this is not the mother of 18 kids or the person that is looking for a better job than whats out there. This is for the people that are physically or mentally not able to support themselves no matter how hard they try.
How many people have enough saving to live the next 12 month with no income? How many people bought a house they could not afford with no income for 12 months. how many americans are responsible and not waiting for the goverment to “assist them”?
I work a full time job (10 hours a day with driving), I work on my own stuff 1-6 hours a day. Who has the right to tell me I should be giving more of my money to someone on welfare? are they working 11-16 hours a day?
Look what is happening to California, they entitle everthing and are beyond fiscal recovery. Are they dropping these entitlements? nope they want to make the rest of America do the same. When it comes to the point poeple no longer will work for 11-16 hours a day to get ahead, or 8 5 days a week because well they can collect their entitlements the economy is dead, as well as capitolism.
See the health items inserted in the new bill? If your old deal with the pains of being old. real fat? well there will be people to decide if its worth giving you tratment as the cost may outweigh you expected future health and lifespan. Doctors will be monitored on what treatments they give you and repremended if they go outside what the GOVERMENT reccomneds. What ever happened to patient / doctor trust? well just like your business partner in every business uncle sam will now oversee what he considers the future value of your life and decide to spend the cash on you or just let you out to pasture.
Its getting real scary real fast. You say your just worried about the UIGEA, thats the problem with the country, people focus on what do I need, what will make me happy and they cant see the bigger picture of the collapse of the country. This is not a Democratic destruction, this has been going on for many years. Dont get caught in the rep vs Dem garbage, thats exactly what they want you to focus on as they make more and more people DEPENDANT on the goverment. They no longer work for us, dont forget that and dont let it continue.
@slotplayer 197087 wrote:
Let me ask you, what is stopping ecomomic growth? Taxes are still at the same rate.
Telling everyone were in the great depression and save your money is a good start no? News networks all day long saying you need to hide your money. Credit is shot, there should be real people in real jail for credit swaps / risk / forcing sub prime lending.
History tells when you try to make everone a success you prevent success from occuring for all.
@allfreechips 197084 wrote:
Thats the problem, Goverment needs to get out of the picture and let the economy recover. Saving failing business with cash is a dead end. Spending is the same as you getting another credit card because you cant pay the min on the one you maxed out. Yeah it feels good for a little while but then your twice as screwed later.
I agree 100%. Sometimes reform can only come when the bottom is hit and perhaps things need to be torn down and rebuilt. Bailing out companies that are fundamentally flawed will not fix anything long term, only encourage inefficiencies in our economy.
Here’s an example of the credit problem. I live in California and many of my friends have their homes in foreclosure. My buddies who own multi-million dollar homes are being bailed out will ridiculously low payments while no aid is given to the people with lower valued homes. Many of these guys with multi-million dollar homes have no business owning these in the first place and got in way over their heads. To me, this just encourages irresponsible spending.
Exactly, rewarding failure is the end of the civilization.
Remember when America was tough? didn’t take crap from anyone? People helped people in this country and there was a dire need to work to succeed. That need has been replaced with promises of government assistance.
another 1.6 trillion for a new rescue package! woooo!
yep were in slight deflation period.. Wait for inflation to kick in and we will be carting our money around in wheel barrows to buy bread (just look at zimbabwee – extreeme i know)
If you want some real economic truth see this guy http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse
Real interesting watch. mind you it takes 3hrs — but well worth it if you dont know much
Time to load up on gold n silver ?
(me thinks so)
