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I had almost $1200 due me for April. When I didn’t receive it I emailed Focal Click asking where it was. I got this response:
I was waiting to see what they were going to do with this but I believe
they decided not to pay because the same customer who beat us in March lost about the same amount in April so it was kind of a wash. Since there were no more than 3 customers playing in April management reserves the right to make these kind of decisions. I hope you understand. Please let me know if you have any questions about this.Regards,
Does this make sense to anyone? I thought the whole point of not having a carryover was for exactly this case. Why should it matter if I have 3 customers or 300? Now I am due about $700 for May. Are they going to say “Management decided you had a winner last August so we aren’t going to pay.”
I’m wondering how others feel about the program at Focal Click. Should I just stop promoting them?
You are right. This doesnt make sense. I am going to move this down to the Focal Area and see what they have to say about this.
that is the most fu@@ed up thing i ever heard.
I hope you understand. Please let me know if you have any questions about this.
I’m not fully understanding and hope to get a clarification here real soon.
This is simply a management decision in certain cases where an affiliate is not sending any traffic, has no more than 3 active customers playing in their account and the casino is not making a profit from those customers. Most of the time it involves one or two customers who win one month, for example $5,000 then lose $5,000 the following month, win $5,000 the next month, lose $5,000 the following month, so on and so on. The casino makes zilch so management cannot justify paying commission on money they haven’t made.
In this particular case, the affiliate sent us one customer a while back who has continued to play with us for several months winning one or two months then losing less than they won in a following month. This customer is up $4,100 with us yet we’ve paid the affiliate over $2,000 in earnings. We did not pay this affiliate a few months back when the same customer loss $800 during the month because the player had beaten us by $10,550 the previous two months. I explained this to the affiliate so the following month this affiliate sent us four new customers, ALL from California. All four customers played the exact same game in one day. Three of these customers wagered twice (again, on the exact same game), $50 each time and lost $100 (never to play again) while the other player beat us by $1,400 (never to play again). This obviously was not a coincidence and was done to surpass the more than “3 active customers” policy.
It’s unfortunate that these policies must be implemented but we must protect ourselves in certain situations such as the above.
Regards,
I had a winner with wagerprofits an $11k winner with wagerprofits back in March. I am a brand new affiliate mind you. To make a long story short the guy lost back the $11k in april, and they paid me commission on the loss. Now I know they were not in the black with this player, he only deposited like $200, so the bottom line is they paid me like $3k commission on a player that they only made a couple hundred.
And if I recall when I first came into this business the latter part of 2005, there was a very similar situation with focal click. Frank, I think affiliates understand that it is tough to pay commissions out on a player that has not been profitable for you. But why do you advertise no negative carry over then?
I remember that old thread clearly, same situation. I remember saying what next, a player wins at your casino, then a year later he loses some back to you, then you choose not to pay the commission because he is up on the house.
It is your business and clearly you run it the way you see fit, and trust me I understand. I just think perhaps a lot of this is created because you boast no neg carry over, yet when you deem it is appropriate, and from a business perspective I can certainly appreciate that, you do it anyway. That is the problem.
To Focal Clicks credit, they do clearly state they can do this in the T&Cs. However, what I don’t understand is they also say that if you have one player that wins at one of their casinos, then the same player loses at another one of their casinos, that they will still pay commissions on the losses. I don’t see a big difference between this and the situation happening here.
Since promoting them I have sent them 7 players. If some of them didn’t continue playing there is nothing I can do about that. I understand you don’t want to pay out money when you are losing money, but surely you can understand that we all would like a clear set of rules.
If you state in your policy something like, “Management reserves the right to bundle or carryover as we see fit.” Then we as affiliates can make an informed decision about promoting you.
We don’t have negative carryovers but management must include that clause in order to protect themselves. You wouldn’t believe some of the crazy schemes we’ve seen affiliates try to pull. These affiliates are rare but they pop up every once in a while so we must protect ourselves from them.
Anyway, this isn’t one of those cases but again; the casino can’t continue to pay commissions on money they haven’t earned. Again, if there were more than 3 active players playing and fresh traffic coming in we would pay because we know that the other customers will make up for the wins of one or two players. When there is one customer playing every month, no new fresh traffic coming in and the player is winning one month then losing less the next we must make exceptions from time to time.
I do understand both sides of this issue but this decision is not mine to be made. I am more than willing to help affiliates avoid this but if certain trends continue and the casino loses money off one customer in an affiliate’s account they will take the necessary steps sooner or later in order to protect themselves.
Regards,
